Radha Soami Satsang Beas
NO RESPONSE IS BETTER THAN ILLOGICAL RESPONSE
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rajatkwatra
It is requested that any one giving response must first satisfy himself whether he or she is giving logical or illogical response to a discussion.
Instead of suggesting some one to do this or that, must substantiate your reasoning.
There are number of things which can not be proved, but it will be wrong to state that raising question for that is illogical.
When some one is stating that donations use must be disclosed or instead of using donations for making satsang ground which is used for only 5-6 hours in a week, schools, college, hospital for poor needy people can be made, then what is wrong in this?

CAN ANY ONE PROVE THAT SCHOOL N HOSPITAL ARE LESS BENEFICIAL THEN SATSANG?

Even those satsang sthal can be converted in to schhol, tution centre for poor people where RSSB followers can do sewa by teaching them.

At night the sheds can be provided to poor people for providing shelter.

Followers must appreciate that service of man kind is supreme work on this earth but instead of that my knowledge is questioned on this forum.

Further it is stated that it is used for charity but not highlighted, if that is the case then give me one example of charity which you yourself knew.

On one side we state that it is the wastage of money that milk is used on shivling in temple then how it is not waste that crores of rupees is spent for acquiring land which is used for not more than 6 hours in a week.

I have countered that the land is not in baba g name, I am not stating that who owns it, but i am strict to my question that how you justify this usage.

It is also correct that langar and subsidied food is provided in bhandaras. But only existing and prospective followers will go to Bhandaras, who also give donations. What about crores of below poverty line human beings, have any charity for them is done?

When I ask that CD/DVD required, you ask piracy will be done, cost will be heavy, what if few hours spent, you are asking because you are a resonable income group family memeber, think for those who earns daily and then only can spent out of that. For them a single day without earning means all of their family will sleep without food in night.
Think for old people age of 70-80, will they be able to reach without pain.

But for this requirement, il logical answer is provided. Think from open mind that what ever we learn from some one, we cant reproduced same in totallity, but we will present as per our understanding. IF CD will be there, any one can check his understanding by listening again and again on CD.

You followers are fighting like we are questioning Baba g and you come in defence, which is totally incorrect approach or your attitude problem.

We are criticising the practice, which must be modified as per exisitng environment.

Followers must themselves first read the articls on this forum from other followers then analyse that if old followers are mis understanding the teaching, why it is happening and try to resolve on their individual issue but instead of that, fighting to us is started.

Before giving suggestion to others for reading books, first reconfirm whether you yourself are able to understand the teaching in books in same way as the writer intended. If yes then you explain and substantiate which must be logical also, else do not respond.

When some follower is stating that in the age of 22 years, i want to take naam and settle in beas n do not want to marry and want to get rid of punar janam. It is simply mean that his understanding of RSSB is totally incomplete.

At that aga clearly advised to perform your duties like study etc. and also always asked to face challenge in life, marriage is a social obligation, which must be comlied and if you are living parents at your age of 22, it mean you are betraying them at their old age for your own selfishness.

Fight in life in all adverse situation and also win it is one thing for which god has send us so why should we escape. It is true that we love Baba g and want to stay before him but must be reminded that it is alos advised that we must be indulged in MOH and it is our MOH for him.

So we practice wrong and if any one question, he is treated and non follower.

Thanks.



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replied to:  rajatkwatra
susingh
Replied to:  It is requested that any one giving response must first satisfy...
BHAGWAAN KO PAANE KE DO HE TO TAREEKE HAIN:-

1. HATT YOG/BAHKTI YOG JISME BLIND FAITH (WITHOUT USE OF WISDOM OF MIND) PLAYS THE MAJOR ROLE TO REACH GOD! But this mode of reaching GOD may or may not succeed in the long run to the desired levels. In some cases like in case of Ravan and that of KANS, result are visible in their cases, who captured GOD through BHAKTI YOG/HATT YOG by obtaining all powers of GOD and finally reached highest level of PROUD/EGO to challenge even GOD!

2. KARAM YOG is very simple and requires only wisdom of mind for its application at every stage in life. But it is very simple mode of reaching GOD with love and love only as is the case of GURUNANAK and KABIR, who displayed their simple life and by sowing the seeds of their best KARMAS to serve mankind apart from displaying their love for GOD instead of spreading any fears of GOD. Who does not know the story of SACHCHA SAUDA?

Same is the case of teachings of present RSSB BABAJI whose teachings, if not subjected to any miss-interpretations at such a large scale, and are well taken can bring quite different results. But here again in absence of availability of his recorded SATSANG, its misgivings are playing a major role of distrust and sufferings among SATSANGIS and nothing else.
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replied to:  susingh
starspeed
Replied to:  BHAGWAAN KO PAANE KE DO HE TO TAREEKE HAIN:- 1. HATT...
Here are answer to your questions,

"1. HATT YOG/BAHKTI YOG JISME BLIND FAITH (WITHOUT USE OF WISDOM OF MIND) PLAYS THE MAJOR ROLE TO REACH GOD! But this mode of reaching GOD may or may not succeed in the long run to the desired levels. In some cases like in case of Ravan and that of KANS, result are visible in their cases, who captured GOD through BHAKTI YOG/HATT YOG by obtaining all powers of GOD and finally reached highest level of PROUD/EGO to challenge even GOD! "

==> Ravana didn't done bhakti yoga, instead he did TAPASYA of brahma and shiva to get boon/power. If he did bhakti yoga, he would have surely got rid of proud/ego which is one of the five evils.






"2. KARAM YOG is very simple and requires only wisdom of mind for its application at every stage in life. But it is very simple mode of reaching GOD with love and love only as is the case of GURUNANAK and KABIR, who displayed their simple life and by sowing the seeds of their best KARMAS to serve mankind apart from displaying their love for GOD instead of spreading any fears of GOD."

==> Doing good karma only doesn't necessarily grant you permanent salvation. Meditation is also required.
Have a look at this excerpt from Granth Sahib,

ਨਾਨਕ ਗੁਰੁ ਸੰਤੋਖੁ ਰੁਖੁ ਧਰਮੁ ਫੁਲੁ ਫਲ ਗਿਆਨੁ ॥
नानक गुरु संतोखु रुखु धरमु फुलु फल गिआनु ॥
Nānak gur sanṯokẖ rukẖ ḏẖaram ful fal gi▫ān.
O Nanak, the Guru is the tree of contentment, with flowers of faith, and fruits of spiritual wisdom.

ਰਸਿ ਰਸਿਆ ਹਰਿਆ ਸਦਾ ਪਕੈ ਕਰਮਿ ਧਿਆਨਿ ॥
रसि रसिआ हरिआ सदा पकै करमि धिआनि ॥
Ras rasi▫ā hari▫ā saḏā pakai karam ḏẖi▫ān.
Watered with the Lord's Love, it remains forever green; through the karma of good deeds and meditation, it ripens.

ਪਤਿ ਕੇ ਸਾਦ ਖਾਦਾ ਲਹੈ ਦਾਨਾ ਕੈ ਸਿਰਿ ਦਾਨੁ ॥੧॥
पति के साद खादा लहै दाना कै सिरि दानु ॥१॥
Paṯ ke sāḏ kẖāḏā lahai ḏānā kai sir ḏān. ||1||
Honor is obtained by eating this tasty dish; of all gifts, this is the greatest gift. ||1||

(Guru Granth Sahib Page 147)




"3. Same is the case of teachings of present RSSB BABAJI whose teachings, if not subjected to any miss-interpretations at such a large scale, and are well taken can bring quite different results. But here again in absence of availability of his recorded SATSANG, its misgivings are playing a major role of distrust and sufferings among SATSANGIS and nothing else."

Teachings of all RSSB gurus are same. Audio CDs and some videos of previous guru are made available at all deras.
If you can't make it to satsang, then you can buy these CDs and also read sant mat books.
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replied to:  rajatkwatra
starspeed
Replied to:  It is requested that any one giving response must first satisfy...
1. "It is requested that any one giving response must first satisfy himself whether he or she is giving logical or illogical response to a discussion.
Instead of suggesting some one to do this or that, must substantiate your reasoning.
There are number of things which can not be proved, but it will be wrong to state that raising question for that is illogical.
When some one is stating that donations use must be disclosed or instead of using donations for making satsang ground which is used for only 5-6 hours in a week, schools, college, hospital for poor needy people can be made, then what is wrong in this? "

==> You are right. There may be some responses that may be illogical. But same goes for illogical questions.
Satsang ground is for congregation of people and to listen to the satsangs. Without this, there would be no satsang. If i go according to your saying, then there all temples, gurudwaras etc must be changed to school and then there will be no congregation of people and the belief in god will fade away.
The above things you mentioned like opening schools, colleges, hospitals etc are duties of indian government. What are they doing. In my local area, three empty government schools are there. Students are willing to come but there are no teachers as government is not willing to pay enough to the teachers.
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replied to:  rajatkwatra
starspeed
Replied to:  It is requested that any one giving response must first satisfy...
2."CAN ANY ONE PROVE THAT SCHOOL N HOSPITAL ARE LESS BENEFICIAL THEN SATSANG?"

==> Can you prove its not? Everything is beneficial in its own way. In my opinion Satsang is also a school and a hospital at the same time. In Satsang we are being to teached sant mat principles and how to deal with five evil diseases at the same time.







3."Even those satsang sthal can be converted in to schhol, tution centre for poor people where RSSB followers can do sewa by teaching them.
At night the sheds can be provided to poor people for providing shelter.
Followers must appreciate that service of man kind is supreme work on this earth but instead of that my knowledge is questioned on this forum.
Further it is stated that it is used for charity but not highlighted, if that is the case then give me one example of charity which you yourself knew.
On one side we state that it is the wastage of money that milk is used on shivling in temple then how it is not waste that crores of rupees is spent for acquiring land which is used for not more than 6 hours in a week.
I have countered that the land is not in baba g name, I am not stating that who owns it, but i am strict to my question that how you justify this usage.
It is also correct that langar and subsidied food is provided in bhandaras. But only existing and prospective followers will go to Bhandaras, who also give donations. What about crores of below poverty line human beings, have any charity for them is done? "


==> Regarding charity work, lots of unpublished/unadvertised work is done by dera anonymously. They have opened some hospitals and schools like beas hospital etc.
Some charity work you can read here,
(a) http://www.greaterkashmir.com/news/2011/jan/26/working-of-ngos-in-ladakh-3.asp

Excerpt:- "But the experience is not that bad all the way, the best one was from the Radha Swami Satsang Beas (RSSB. In all they constructed 6 community shelters at most affected places and their state-of-art construction is just seeing-is-believing. They approached the administration for just identification of sites of construction to be done by them, and did this job in record one month time at all the places. Their next meet with us was when a soft spoken, down-to-earth, former Air Vice Marshal entered my office and thanked with all humility for being given the “opportunity” to help the people, and handed over the keys. No press statements, no inaugurations, no sign boards or marks of RSSB on these building – it was first time in my life I saw an organisation having contributed in real terms for the poor and tragedy hit people and not claiming even an iota of publicity."

(b) http://www.expressindia.com/news/fullstory.php?newsid=58274

Excerpt:- "Similarly, another NGO, Radha Swami Satsang Religious Trust, which constructed 90 buildings for primary schools in Santalpur taluka of Patan district in North Gujarat region, is building 11 community structures in Tanghdar."

(c) Some more of their work you can read here,
http://www.rssb.org/articles.php

Note:- Just because you don't often listen charity work in newspaper DOESN'T IMPLY that they don't do it.
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replied to:  rajatkwatra
starspeed
Replied to:  It is requested that any one giving response must first satisfy...
4. "When I ask that CD/DVD required, you ask piracy will be done, cost will be heavy, what if few hours spent, you are asking because you are a resonable income group family memeber, think for those who earns daily and then only can spent out of that. For them a single day without earning means all of their family will sleep without food in night.
Think for old people age of 70-80, will they be able to reach without pain.But for this requirement, il logical answer is provided. Think from open mind that what ever we learn from some one, we cant reproduced same in totallity, but we will present as per our understanding. IF CD will be there, any one can check his understanding by listening again and again on CD."

==> I am not properly able to stand what you want to convey. If you are talking about availability of Satsang CDs, then YES they are AVAILABLE at every RS outlet.






5. "When some follower is stating that in the age of 22 years, i want to take naam and settle in beas n do not want to marry and want to get rid of punar janam. It is simply mean that his understanding of RSSB is totally incomplete.
At that aga clearly advised to perform your duties like study etc. and also always asked to face challenge in life, marriage is a social obligation, which must be comlied and if you are living parents at your age of 22, it mean you are betraying them at their old age for your own selfishness. "

==> This point i agree with you. Even after initiation you are bound to live a moral life and perform your duties which is one of the vows of initiation.



6. "Fight in life in all adverse situation and also win it is one thing for which god has send us so why should we escape. It is true that we love Baba g and want to stay before him but must be reminded that it is alos advised that we must be indulged in MOH and it is our MOH for him. "

==> You are right. God has sent us to comply with our duties also. Excessive worldly Moh results in addiction and enslavement to substances, fashion, money, pleasure, power, fame and other illusive worldly pursuits. A proper balance has to made so that we don't neglect our spiritual life.
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replied to:  starspeed
susingh
Replied to:  Here are answer to your questions, "1. HATT YOG/BAHKTI YOG JISME...
1. (==> Ravana didn't done bhakti yoga, instead he did TAPASYA of brahma and shiva to get boon/power. If he did bhakti yoga, he would have surely got rid of proud/ego which is one of the five evils.)

Answer: There does not appear to be any difference between TAPSYA or BHAKTI since both are covered under HATT YOG to reach GOD in the above box.

2. (==> Doing good karma only doesn't necessarily grant you permanent salvation. Meditation is also required.)

ANSWER:- the entire KARMA philosophy revolve around clearing debt accounts of the soul for merger of soul with GOD. Once one’s KARMA account gets cleared, the soul is bound to be free to merge in GOD and meditation alone cannot be of any use for merging into GOD without clearing KARMA account of any soul.

One might have heard many stories that many people living their life as atheists but doing lot of best KARMAS. Who does not know about SHAHID BHAGAT SINGH who was an atheist? But many DAAKUS are heard of bowing their head in front of god before going for their assignment of the day i.e. for going for looting any bank or a house.

3. (O Nanak, the Guru is the tree of contentment, with flowers of faith, and fruits of spiritual wisdom. Watered with the Lord's Love, it remains forever green; through the karma of good deeds and meditation, it ripens.)

Answer:-Yes! Lord’s love remains green for ever through KARMA of Good deeds and if it is coupled with meditation also then it is termed as “ SONE PE SUHAGA” So is the basis of a belief that BABAJI or any GURU cannot help in clearing one’s KARMA debts of one’s previous or current bad deeds.

4. (Teachings of all RSSB gurus are same. Audio CDs and some videos of previous guru are made available at all deras. If you can't make it to satsang, then you can buy these CDs and also read sant mat books.)

Answer:-If teachings of all RSSB GURUS are same, then the basic philosophy of need for a live GURU gets defeated and there was no need to differ from SIKHISM but to rely upon the BAANI or teachings of various GURUS as compiled in GURU GRANTH SAHIB. But here is the thrust for the teachings of live GURU, who has reservations for allowing recording of his teachings in defiance to other RSSB GURUS whose teachings/SATSANG records are admittedly available at all DERAS. The reasons for such reservations are not understod by any one and could be best known to bABAJI alone.This thrust becomes more important because of misgivings arising out of wrong teachings spread through various speakers in different SATSANG centers worldwide.
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replied to:  susingh
starspeed
Replied to:  1. (==> Ravana didn't done bhakti yoga, instead he did TAPASYA of...
"There does not appear to be any difference between TAPSYA or BHAKTI since both are covered under HATT YOG to reach GOD in the above box. "

==> Get your facts right. Yes, there is difference between tapasaya and bhakti. TAPASYA used to be done to achieve some selfish desire like boon, power, some worldly object etc(Manmukh). But Bhakti is selfless and unconditional love towards god to ultimately merge with him through guru's shabad i.e unstruck sound-current(Gurumukh) also known as Surat Shabad yoga. Hatha yoga is totally different from tapasya and bhakti. Hatha yoga is a yoga system of physical exercises and breathing control performed with much self‐torture, such as standing on one leg, holding up the arms, inhaling smoke with the head inverted. You can't compare Hatha yoga with Surat Shabad Yoga just like apple and oranges.





"the entire KARMA philosophy revolve around clearing debt accounts of the soul for merger of soul with GOD. Once one’s KARMA account gets cleared, the soul is bound to be free to merge in GOD and meditation alone cannot be of any use for merging into GOD without clearing KARMA account of any soul.

==> I think it's your philosophy. KARMA is a fail-proof system under the control of kaal. You can't escape it by doing good karmas alone. You would have to reincarnate again to work out your karma in next birth. And then you have to come again in third birth according to deeds done by you in previous birth. This is an endless cycle. You would have to have a entity that is beyond karmic mortal world who can work out your karma, save you and provide immortablity and this entity is a perfect living master.
Have a look at this kabir bani on kaal in anurag sagar,
http://i.imgur.com/bmCvua4.png






"One might have heard many stories that many people living their life as atheists but doing lot of best KARMAS. Who does not know about SHAHID BHAGAT SINGH who was an atheist? But many DAAKUS are heard of bowing their head in front of god before going for their assignment of the day i.e. for going for looting any bank or a house. "

==> Shahid bhagat singh may have done very good karmas, but that doesn't gurantee salvation after reading my above post, does it?
The devotion of that daaku is worthless, if he can't abide by the rules of a true guru.






"Yes! Lord’s love remains green for ever through KARMA of Good deeds and if it is coupled with meditation also then it is termed as “ SONE PE SUHAGA”

==> There is no 'if' & 'or'. It is 'and' between 'karma of good deeds' & 'meditation'. Meditation is not something like 'sone pe sugaga'. Instead it's the primordial job of a true gurumukh.
Have a look at more of these excerpts from granth sahib,

ਸੁਖ ਸਾਗਰੁ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਹੈ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਪਾਇਆ ਜਾਇ ॥
सुख सागरु हरि नामु है गुरमुखि पाइआ जाइ ॥
Sukẖ sāgar har nām hai gurmukẖ pā▫i▫ā jā▫e.
The Name of the Lord is the Ocean of Peace; the Gurmukhs obtain it.

ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਈਐ ਸਹਜੇ ਨਾਮਿ ਸਮਾਇ ॥
अनदिनु नामु धिआईऐ सहजे नामि समाइ ॥
An▫ḏin nām ḏẖi▫ā▫ī▫ai sėhje nām samā▫e.
Meditating on the Naam, night and day, they are easily and intuitively absorbed in the Naam.

ਗੁਰ ਸਰਣਾਈ ਸੁਖੁ ਲਹਹਿ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
गुर सरणाई सुखु लहहि अनदिनु नामु धिआइ ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
Gur sarṇā▫ī sukẖ lahėh an▫ḏin nām ḏẖi▫ā▫e. ||1|| rahā▫o.
In the Sanctuary of the Guru, peace is found, meditating on the Naam night and day. ||1||Pause||

ਸਾਚੇ ਮੈਲੁ ਨ ਲਾਗਈ ਮਨੁ ਨਿਰਮਲੁ ਹਰਿ ਧਿਆਇ ॥
साचे मैलु न लागई मनु निरमलु हरि धिआइ ॥
Sācẖe mail na lāg▫ī man nirmal har ḏẖi▫ā▫e.
The truthful ones are not stained by filth. Meditating on the Lord, their minds remain pure.

ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਜਪ ਤਪ ਸੰਜਮੀ ਹਰਿ ਕੈ ਨਾਮਿ ਪਿਆਰੁ ॥
गुरमुखि जप तप संजमी हरि कै नामि पिआरु ॥
Gurmukẖ jap ṯap sanjmī har kai nām pi▫ār.
For the Gurmukh, the love of the Name of the Lord is chanting, deep meditation and self-discipline.

ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਸਦਾ ਧਿਆਈਐ ਏਕੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਕਰਤਾਰੁ ॥
गुरमुखि सदा धिआईऐ एकु नामु करतारु ॥
Gurmukẖ saḏā ḏẖi▫ā▫ī▫ai ek nām karṯār.
The Gurmukh meditates forever on the Name of the One Creator Lord.

ਨਾਨਕ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਈਐ ਸਭਨਾ ਜੀਆ ਕਾ ਆਧਾਰੁ ॥੪॥੭॥੪੦॥
नानक नामु धिआईऐ सभना जीआ का आधारु ॥४॥७॥४०॥
Nānak nām ḏẖi▫ā▫ī▫ai sabẖnā jī▫ā kā āḏẖār. ||4||7||40||
O Nanak, meditate on the Naam, the Name of the Lord, the Support of all beings. ||4||7||40||

(Guru Granth Sahib Page 29)





"So is the basis of a belief that BABAJI or any GURU cannot help in clearing one’s KARMA debts of one’s previous or current bad deeds."

==> Have a look at this kabir bani in anurag sagar again,
http://i.imgur.com/XOl1mrg.png






"If teachings of all RSSB GURUS are same, then the basic philosophy of need for a live GURU gets defeated and there was no need to differ from SIKHISM but to rely upon the BAANI or teachings of various GURUS as compiled in GURU GRANTH SAHIB."

You probably don't much about Sant Mat principles. A perfect living master/Satguru is still required who initiates you to the naam/shabad i.e unstruck sound current which reverberates in everybody but noone is consciously aware of it. It is made consciously aware by a living guru. And you can't pass all of the inner spiritual realms without a guru. And the bani you are talking about is the unstruck melodious sound that vibrates within you if you are initiated by a guru.

Have a look at this excerpt from granth sahib again,

ਅਨਹਦ ਸਬਦਿ ਸੁਹਾਵਣੇ ਪਾਈਐ ਗੁਰ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥੨॥
अनहद सबदि सुहावणे पाईऐ गुर वीचारि ॥२॥
Anhaḏ sabaḏ suhāvaṇe pā▫ī▫ai gur vīcẖār. ||2||
The beautiful, Unstruck Sound of the Shabad is obtained, contemplating the Guru. ||2||

(Guru Granth Sahib Page 21)





"But here is the thrust for the teachings of live GURU, who has reservations for allowing recording of his teachings in defiance to other RSSB GURUS whose teachings/SATSANG records are admittedly available at all DERAS. The reasons for such reservations are not understod by any one and could be best known to bABAJI alone.This thrust becomes more important because of misgivings arising out of wrong teachings spread through various speakers in different SATSANG centers worldwide. "

==> It seems you are under delusion. I have said it already and saying again. The teachings are still the same be it 100 years ago, or be it now. So doesn't matter. The very possible reason that strikes to my intellect is that to attract congregation of people to hold satsang. Few months back, i had seen a virtual worship software or something like that in which you can visit many holy places like temple, gurudwara etc but virtually only on computer. It looked great, but didn't gave the same blissful sensation as in real satsang among real people. Same rule may be applied here. If all satsangs are taken to virtual world, then that will be nothing more than just a formality.





"This thrust becomes more important because of misgivings arising out of wrong teachings spread through various speakers in different SATSANG centers worldwide."

==> I haven't seen wrong teachings and subsequent misgiving arising on that account in satsangs held by public speakers. But even if there is any as you say, then it is advised for you to read sant mat books and listen to official satsang cds available at all RS outlets at the same time.
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replied to:  starspeed
susingh
Replied to:  "There does not appear to be any difference between TAPSYA or...
Sorry! Hold such orguments which are like as if 2+2=3 or 5 and not 4! Hence no more discussion please by leaving it here to be adjudged by all who read this discussion, more so when the Scientist of the "Science of the Soul" believes that (1)Science can never require any possitive changes and is sticking to his pholosophy by not allowing recording of his SATSANG for releasing to devotees (a disrespect to earlier GURUS who allowed releasing their recorded teachings/SATSANG, since available)for reasons best known to him as also who believes in(2) living a lavish life by affording to travel in personal jet plane with personal security gaurd (3)bowing his head before GURU GRANTH SAHIB out of his own conscious (4) meeting with RSS chief in close door and (5)attaining the status of RSSB GURU suddenly without having any link earlier, since he was living in Paris quite in different style.(6) Even if no one has any copy right to use BANI of any other saints picked up from GURU GRANTH SAHIB, even then there should have been some contribution by RSSB GURU by developing and adding some by BABAJI also. In fact in view of non provision of copy right, the use of BANI by RSSB GURUS alone, during SATSANG, does display nothing but their ------------(Devotees to fill in the balnk who are kept away from GURUGRANTH SAHIB to bow their heads before BABAJI or photos of other RSSB GURUS!

If all other cited literature is to be believed then why all other facts available on internet about his life be turned down since never refuted by BABAJI himself?

So finally the topic of this box turns to be true that "NO RESPONSE IS BETTER THAN ILLOGICAL RESPONSE"
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replied to:  susingh
starspeed
Replied to:  Sorry! Hold such orguments which are like as if 2+2=3 or...
My reaction,

**Facepalm**
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replied to:  susingh
starspeed
Replied to:  Sorry! Hold such orguments which are like as if 2+2=3 or...
"Sorry! Hold such orguments which are like as if 2+2=3 or 5 and not 4! Hence no more discussion please by leaving it here to be adjudged by all who read this discussion,"

==> Kindly put forward facts to invalidate my arguments or quotes from scriptures if any. Rest assured, i will not be offended!

"Hence no more discussion please by leaving it here to be adjudged by all who read this discussion, more so when the Scientist of the "Science of the Soul" believes that (1)Science can never require any possitive changes"

==> I too believe that science is the name of change or i would say recognize the truth. But there are some laws of nature which never change. Change in this sense is just a misnomer and represents degree of recognition. Spritiuality also comes under the same scrutiny but not necessarily the same due to impractibility. That's why it is termed as pseudo science. Because it is quantified on the results of mystical experiences experienced by the person alone. In fact, i don't think that you can attach a physical equipment to a person and record his/her experiences and capture it on a device. Many experiments have been carried by US related to paranormal activities but it was quashed away simply due to inefficay of the persons individual experiences and not produced physically(Learn more about this under Stargate Project).

"living a lavish life by affording to travel in personal jet plane with personal security gaurd"
(a disrespect to earlier GURUS who allowed releasing their recorded teachings/SATSANG, since available)for reasons best known to him as also who believes in(2) living a lavish life by affording to travel in personal jet plane with personal security gaurd (3)bowing his head before GURU GRANTH SAHIB out of his own conscious (4) meeting with RSS chief in close door and (5)attaining the status of RSSB GURU suddenly without having any link earlier, since he was living in Paris quite in different style.(6)In fact in view of non provision of copy right, the use of BANI by RSSB GURUS alone, during SATSANG, does display nothing but their ------------(Devotees to fill in the balnk who are kept away from GURUGRANTH SAHIB to bow their heads before BABAJI or photos of other RSSB GURUS! "

Ah. Now i see your roots. Your hostile behavior confirmed it. Thanks!!
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replied to:  starspeed
susingh
Replied to:  "Sorry! Hold such orguments which are like as if 2+2=3 or...
(Ah. Now i see your roots. Your hostile behavior confirmed it. Thanks!!)

no comments, more so when Mr. Starspeed has also prescribed some qualification also for participating, in this forum in general, but to his posts in particular. So first let someone submit such degree (of initiation) before going ahead to deal with his posts. Rather roots and behavior also need to be got checked from Mr. Starspeed before responding to such posts.
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